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ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand (Read 4265 times)
RedMan
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ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
02/16/12 at 09:35:09
 
ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
 
I've had it, this guy has to be stopped. In a simply astounding blog post, ATV Television host Doug Meyer has come out swinging in an attempt to force UTVs off of the Paiute ATV Trail system.
Read it here:
http://atvtelevision.blogspot.com/2012/02/future-of-paiute-trail-system.html
 
 
In effect he says UTVs are ruining the trail and they must be banned before the trail system is destroyed.
He goes so far as to say that the damage UTVs are causing in Moab and Imperial Dunes and to the Paiute will result in them being shut down.
He defines UTVs as "incredibly high-speed vehicles that have in turn increased both personal injuries and ecological damage multifold".
 
 
His parting shot is a clear indication that he thinks UTV owners are simply a bunch of speed freaks ruining the scenery of the Paiute Trail.
 
 
Quote:
"All this is said not because of my preference for ATVs over UTVs, but rather my preference for scenic trails for exploration over trails used for high-speed entertainment." -Doug Meyer

 
This isn't just a one time blog post, he has taken this argument to the US Forrest Service that manages the Paiute Trail.
He has been a vocal opponent of the UTV Jamboree held each year on the Paiute (utvjam.com), last year urging the city of Marysvale to ban the event.
 
 
I can tell you first hand UTVs are not creating a problem on this trail system, Doug just hates UTVs.
 
 
The amazing thing here is that this guy makes a living largely from UTVs. One look at all of his latest video you see its all about UTVs. I see him wheeling around in UTVs he has been given for FREE all the time.  
I think its time Polaris, Yamaha, Kawasaki and the rest of the manufacturers stop giving this guy free product to use in his business.
 
 
We have enough problems with environmentalists trying to shut us down, we don't need the media that pretends to represent us doing it.
I think its time we let him know we don't appreciate the way he is dogging us.
 
 
Please send emails to the media contacts and tell them to stop supporting a guy who doesn't support this sport.
Donna.Beadle@polarisind.comohvaccess@yamaha-motor.com
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #1 - 02/16/12 at 09:45:20
 
Where there is smoke, there is fire. I am not defending his position or arguing against it. I don't have near the time on the Utah trails as most of you, but my limited exposure has shown that there is considerable trail and gate damage by UTV's going where they should'nt. and a very poor reputation for being trail "hogs" and driving very fast. That is just my perspective. I believe that most UTV's are more closely suited to jeep trails than ATV two track.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #2 - 02/16/12 at 10:13:04
 
I don't post often, I'm a local and I'm an avid ATV rider, you couldn't give me a UTV. But I had to chime in here.
 
This is the same egomaniac who shortly after moving to Marysvale couldn't pay his city water bill and when they informed him they were going to disconnect him if his bill wasn't paid, lost his cool with the Mayor and several others. He went off on them telling them they OWED him a FREE water connection, heck they OWED him an exemption to his property taxes for that matter, because he "put Marysvale on the ATV destination map" Even though he had done less TV segments on the Paiute than any other show at the time and websites like ATVUtah.com, Utah.com, ATVJam.com, Marysvale.org and others had done far more to advertise and introduce riders to the Paiute Trail in one day than he had done in his entire TV career, and still do. He got himself booted from the major cable channels for his arogance and now his show is limited to the internet.
 
Since moving to Marysvale he's alienated almost everyone in town with his arrogant "I'm a TV celebrity so bow down to me you peons" attitude.  
 
Now he's working on alienating a large portion of the audience who made him that celebrity?
 
Looking at his website this is not his first rant on UTV's or wider machines. Ther are several on the subject of his dislike of wider than 50" machines.
 
Whats next? He'll want the entire Paiute designated a Doug Myer private trail?
 
UTV's and ATV's can and do share the Paiute well. Sure there are a few disrespectful individuals who cant follow the rules but that happens with any activity involving mass audiences. Get over it Doug UTV's are here to stay.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #3 - 02/16/12 at 10:31:16
 
That's a flame fest on his blog site..
 
Just like any sport, there are always doofus's out there that ruin it for us, whether on ATV, Motorcycle or SxS.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #4 - 02/16/12 at 10:39:33
 
Quote from BruteForce on 02/16/12 at 10:31:16:
That's a flame fest on his blog site...

 
It's been interesting to watch his reaction to his blog post. At first he was trying to argue his point with them and now he has deleted all his replies. I guess as one person put it "he decided it was better to be called a fool than to open his mouth and remove all doubt"  Grin
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #5 - 02/16/12 at 10:45:31
 
Doug lives in Marysvale? I thought he was in the Payson area..
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #6 - 02/16/12 at 11:13:40
 
Sorry, I'm all for more 50" restrictions on the Paiute and other national forest areas for one simple reason: its more fun to ride a designated 50" trail than it is to ride on a road (or a really wide "trail"). Selfish answer? Sure, but its the best I've got.  
 
However, if it can fit on a 50" trail, then fine, and that includes SxS.  But there has to be a line drawn somewhere, and if ATVs begin to exceed 50" then exclude them, too.  
 
I agree 100% with Doug when he stated: "With the advent of UTVs . . . the difference between the ATVs and the full-sized vehicles became blurred."  Just because someone buys an OHV does not mean they should be able to take their OHV anywhere that all other (smaller) OHVs can go.  I like the idea of riding on tight, technical trails.  However, SxS continue to get bigger and bigger (and so do ATVs, but like I said, exclude them at 50").  For me, its not an argument about ATVs vs. SxS (because plenty of SxS can ride 50" trails), its an argument about loosing trails for roads.  
 
And I'm all for keeping designated single track trails, too.      
 
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #7 - 02/16/12 at 18:47:24
 
While on the surface it appears that he simply likes 50" trails and wants more of them (who doesn't), what he is saying is much more important than just that.  
 
In effect he is calling for the Paiute to structure itself in a way that pretty much precludes UTV riders from wanting to ride here.  
 
I think that is very divisive, and the last thing we need in this industry is for our own media representatives to be creating a divided and conquer scenario.  
 
Basically Doug doesn't like UTVs, I'm fine with that.  What I don't like is the way he is calling for the Paiute Trail to adopt a strategy that will essentially keep UTV riders from the Paiute.  Regardless of how you might feel about ATVs vs UTVs the simple math is that UTVs are a growing segment and they represent a MUCH needed economic impact that Doug is simply willing to abandon to get what he wants.  
 
Frankly I don't think this blog entry has anything to do with saving the trail and everything to do with Doug.  
 
This is my response to his blog:  
 
Doug, this is what you have said. UTVs are to the Paiute Trail as Extreme Rock Buggies and super fast sand rails are to Glammis. Ergo we need to do something to stop the extreme damage being caused to the Paiute by these UTVs. So your answer to that is to limit UTV access by making the trail width exclude them, then they wont come to the Paiute.  
 
You specifically call for this saying the main Paiute loop should be 50". You know that these few 50" sections on the Paiute are the ones that make it unpleasant for UTV riders on the Paiute and you want to make it as unpleasant as possible so that the people you don't like will find somewhere else to ride.  
 
I find your efforts to divide this industry for your own personal agenda sad. This is NOT about saving the trail, its about Doug.  
 
You know full well that UTVs are not destroying the Paiute and that the Paiute is not under the kinds of pressures or environmental threats as Moab and Glammis simply because it is a well managed trail system and you also know that IF the Paiute opens a FEW 50" trails to wider vehicles that this does not pose any more risk to the environment and certainly does not create anywhere near the concerns that Moab and Glammis deal with.  
 
The way you categorically designate UTVs as THE vehicle that will ultimately destroy the Paiute is patently misguided.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #8 - 02/17/12 at 08:01:12
 
Quote from BruteForce on 02/16/12 at 10:45:31:
Doug lives in Marysvale? I thought he was in the Payson area..

Yes Doug lives in Marysvale.  
It was mentioned to me at coffee this morning that this may be nothing more than a publicity stunt by Doug. You see he makes his living from the advertising and youtube videos on his website. If he stirs up a little controversy and gets more visitors to the website many might as a result watch a video or click an advertisement and he in turn makes more money. Perhaps a complete boycott of the site might be a better alternative to posting flaming replies to his blog which he seems to be deleting or not approving anyway.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #9 - 02/18/12 at 09:22:38
 
It's too bad that guys like this have to open their mouths . When someone starts off with negativity , rarely does any good come from it .  
 
I can understand  some of the argument  but is this  really necessary ? Do you ever see SUWA argue with the Sierra Club ? In public ?  
 
I am adamant about different OHVs' staying on their respective trails . That means singletrack gets theirs , atvs' get theirs and so on . 50" trails are needed not only for the experience  they offer but  they are less intrusive on the environment. ( hate to say that but they are )  
 
I don't really like UTVs' but some people do . I'm fine with that as long as they follow the rules as everyone else should .  
 
Doug needs to get a grip . And if he needs help with moving I'll bring a U-Haul down and spend the day . The Paiute has enough problems with the trails being graded  and loss of  " rough " 50" trails and riding opportunities . It doesn't need this too .
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #10 - 02/19/12 at 09:01:19
 
It's too bad that people can't discuss their differences in a civil manor.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #11 - 02/19/12 at 11:39:51
 
Apprently Doug thinks the only reason I have a problem with his blog post is because of some phantom personal Vendetta against him.
 
I'm still laughing about that.  What on earth I would have a personal vendetta gainst him for is beyond me.
 
I have helped him numerous times.
 
Now I have a problem with his publicly stated opinion that UTVs are destroying the Piaute and suddenly I have a vendetta.
 
I'm truly sorry this is the only way he can defend his position.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #12 - 02/19/12 at 16:22:01
 
OMG, he's STILL doing it.
 
In a reply he says ".. to use your Dodge truck example, let's say we both enjoy some really nice UTV trails with our families and gear (because, like you that's what I enjoy!) and all of a sudden a bunch of people show up in lifted 4wd trucks with 40" mud tires, loud exhausts, 12 driving lights across the roof, and beds filled with stereo speakers and hot tubs!"
 
So if I get his comparison, then ATVs are Dodge Trucks and UTVs are "bunch of people show up in lifted 4wd trucks with 40" mud tires, loud exhausts, 12 driving lights across the roof, and beds filled with stereo speakers and hot tubs!"
 
Nice work Doug.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #13 - 02/19/12 at 18:07:06
 
You know , I 'm going to back peddle on this a bit . I have spent quite a bit of time reading and rereading  from Dougs' site and I think that I have learned a bit .  Wink
 
 I don't think that he necessarily wants to shut down UTVs ,  I  think that all  he is pushing for is more 50" trails . I think that he  could have explained himself better at the beginning , but hey , I want more 50" trails too !
 
The FS has a tough job to do managing different user groups and trying to make everyone happy . We KNOW all about the gates that get torn apart, especially on Max Reid . I KNOW the patience of the FS is wearing thin on this issue .  
 
Lets work together before we lose something that will really get everyone  upset .
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #14 - 02/19/12 at 20:29:43
 
I disagree, he is not even asking for "more" 50" trails.
His heartburn is that the USFS is about to open a few 50" trails to 60".
 
He doesn't like that and wants to go back in time to some point where he believes there were more 50" trails and live the "original" intent of narrow trails.  Since he wasn't there I don't know how he knows this was the original intent.  I was there and I have NEVER heard that was the intent.
 
His justification is that UTVs are damaging the environment and generally ruining his experience on the trail.
 
I agree, we have to work together. What Doug has done here is advocate dividing us all.
 
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #15 - 02/19/12 at 20:56:47
 
Quote from RedMan on 02/19/12 at 16:22:01:
OMG, he's STILL doing it.

In a reply he says ".. to use your Dodge truck example, let's say we both enjoy some really nice UTV trails with our families and gear (because, like you that's what I enjoy!) and all of a sudden a bunch of people show up in lifted 4wd trucks with 40" mud tires, loud exhausts, 12 driving lights across the roof, and beds filled with stereo speakers and hot tubs!"

So if I get his comparison, then ATVs are Dodge Trucks and UTVs are "bunch of people show up in lifted 4wd trucks with 40" mud tires, loud exhausts, 12 driving lights across the roof, and beds filled with stereo speakers and hot tubs!"

Nice work Doug.

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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #16 - 02/25/12 at 14:45:22
 
i totally agree. they need to ban the sxs from the piute. i hate going to 5-mile and seeing them buzz around while my boy on his 50cc is learning and they dont take into consideration other riders at all. they go too fast and ppl are stupid as he!! on them.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #17 - 02/25/12 at 15:28:15
 
Quote from SSpeckerwood on 02/25/12 at 14:45:22:
i totally agree. they need to ban the sxs from the piute. i hate going to 5-mile and seeing them buzz around while my boy on his 50cc is learning and they dont take into consideration other riders at all. they go too fast and ppl are stupid as he!! on them.

 
Well I am sorry you do not like SxS.  I will still have my wife riding one.
 
But after looking at some of your pictures I am more concerned about you being out there messing up my snowmobile trails.  You need to stay on dirt and keep off my winter trails.
 
Everyone can find something to complain about.
 
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #18 - 02/25/12 at 15:35:42
 
thats just the thing. me being on your snowmobile trails with a atv doesn't endanger the ability to keep trails open. it may bother you, but in reality it doesn't damage anything other than snow. which will melt and leave no evidence that anyone or anything was riding on it. i understand it may bother you, but i wont be doing 60+ mph on a atv on your snow mobile trails while you have a youth riding around. SxS do damage to everything they touch. SxS like to burn out whenever they can and i've seen 1st hand that they ruin trails and scenery. not to mention most ppl throw every bit of trash in the bed of them without tying it down. then it blows all over the place. almost anyone i've seen in SxS are without helmets or common sense. I really have nothing against SxS, just the stupidity of the majority of riders behind the wheels of them. I think there is a time and place for everything. if you want to go fast make sure there isn't anyone around you that you can endanger. its common sense but when ppl get behind the wheel of a SxS that can handle any bump at any speed and has 65+ hp then the ppl turn into idiots most of the time.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #19 - 02/25/12 at 16:21:39
 
Really!!!!  I can go just as fast on my sportsman and cause just as much damage if I want to and leave just as much trash.   Stupid people can get behind a wheel of anything and destroy not just sxs.  I ride with alot of people that drive sxs and none of them destroy the land or leave trash and go 65 mph plus.  And if the people are going to fast at five mile pass get off the parking lot area and that will all go away or talk to the person about your issue most people would understand.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #20 - 02/25/12 at 16:53:28
 
i dont ever ride or park in the parking area for that very reason. other ppl leave the parking area as well. i'm not saying everyone does it but the majority of SxS riders do it. leave the piute trail to atv's and lets start getting 50" rule put in place in more area's. the only ppl that will complain about it are the ones with SxS.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #21 - 02/25/12 at 17:03:54
 
What about the 50 rzr.  Thats a sxs.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #22 - 02/25/12 at 18:05:22
 
is it under 50" wide??
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #23 - 02/25/12 at 19:13:25
 
I have and drive a rzr, also have had and still have atv's. it is not the machine that srews up the landscape it is the person driving whatever type the machine is, i have seen atv's, sxs, motorcycles, snowmobiles and 4x4 full size vehicles tear up mountains, again it is the driver, it is like saying guns kill people, no idiots with guns kill people. ST George, as far as snowmobile trails i have riden many groomed trails on an ATV and done it legaly and have also helped several snowmobliers out of problems ect due to me being prepaired for where i ride and them not. I also had a atv rider help me out once as i had used all 20 of my plugs on 2 sidewall cuts on my atv and he thought maybe 4r more would help Smiley it didnt but i was glad he stopped. again it is the riders not the machines. So i think that is a crock that anyone can say they dont like @%@$^@@& machines as they do damage  
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #24 - 02/25/12 at 19:13:49
 
Is it so hard to admit that there are idiots in all outdoor sports? I've seen it from backpacking to ATVing. No sport is immune. The answer is policing our own sport. If the things that go on around you bother you...say something to the offending party or report them to the right authority. Some dufas buzzing my grandkids, as you describe, would get a talking to.
 
ATV's are not sacred holders of the trust. There is room for SxS's also.
Lets not divide. We all need to stick together as a group to clean up bad press and save what we have.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #25 - 02/25/12 at 19:16:36
 
And my grandkids are able to enjoy the trails  because of the rzr sxs
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #26 - 02/25/12 at 19:18:06
 
Darn they love the trails
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #27 - 02/25/12 at 19:23:31
 
Yes the rzr is 50 wide.  And I agree idoits are the ones that screw up the trails not machines.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #28 - 02/25/12 at 23:22:45
 
Quote from SSpeckerwood on 02/25/12 at 15:35:42:
thats just the thing. me being on your snowmobile trails with a atv doesn't endanger the ability to keep trails open. it may bother you, but in reality it doesn't damage anything other than snow. which will melt and leave no evidence that anyone or anything was riding on it. i understand it may bother you, but i wont be doing 60+ mph on a atv on your snow mobile trails while you have a youth riding around. SxS do damage to everything they touch. SxS like to burn out whenever they can and i've seen 1st hand that they ruin trails and scenery. not to mention most ppl throw every bit of trash in the bed of them without tying it down. then it blows all over the place. almost anyone i've seen in SxS are without helmets or common sense. I really have nothing against SxS, just the stupidity of the majority of riders behind the wheels of them. I think there is a time and place for everything. if you want to go fast make sure there isn't anyone around you that you can endanger. its common sense but when ppl get behind the wheel of a SxS that can handle any bump at any speed and has 65+ hp then the ppl turn into idiots most of the time.

 
Really?  Is that really what you think or are you arguing for the sake of disagreement?
I doubt very much that you have ever ridden a snowmobile over a groomed trail that has been torn up by insensitive ATV riders.  If I should, perchance, come upon such an area at any sort of reasonable speed I can be thrown all over the trail as my skis go in the ruts made by such riders.
You are arguing from ignorance and seem to lack common sense.
My wife drives a 50" Razr and does not ride as you describe.  I would suggest that you take you children away from the parking lot and find an area where they can learn to ride safely.  That would be a better reaction that expecting those you do not like to satisfy your riding preferences.  It would also be better to take the little ones away from the traffic and larger vehicles.
I see that at the Jericho sand dunes.  All of nuckelheads choose to ride within 50 yards of the campgrounds and do not have the common sense to take their group through all the traffic and go have their fun out where not many go.  Sometimes getting through that traffic can be interesting.
You are simply arguing the wrong side of the argument.
 
StGeorge
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #29 - 02/26/12 at 08:22:41
 
While I thoroughly agree that there ARE idiots that go around the 50" gates in side x sides, there are a great  majority that do obey the rules.  I drive our sxs around the trails in Marysvale while my husband rides his atv.  We stay on the larger trails, do not go flying down the trail, and obey the rules.  We like to take our dog and she is so large that an atv is not a viable option.  Just because you met one bad sxs driver, don't blast us all!  We have been coming to Utah for more than ten years to ride the Pauite and wouldn't endanger it in any way!   Smiley
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #30 - 02/26/12 at 14:59:41
 
contrary to what some of you think, my son doesn't ride the parking area. in fact, he puts more miles on his 50 in a day than most ppl around. how many times have you been on a trail and a SxS almost hits you since there hauling a$$ on it and there to wide just to get around them. i dont think they need to outlaw them, but as i've stated before, there's a time and a place for everything.  
 
i'm not telling anyone on here that they drive like a$$holes. most likely if your on this site you truly care for what the outdoors means and looks like. its all the ppl that dont give a sh!t that get on there super hp machines and tear stuff up.  
 
i've confronted ppl before. if you say anything to anyone they think your insulting there mother.  
 
one example; i was out at grantsville reservoir and right next to my tent in the camping area. a guy in a rzr 900 was doing doughnuts all over in the middle of summer creating a whole lot of dust. when he stopped, i asked if he'd mind doing that somewhere else. he simply stated, "if you dont like the dust go back to the city". i thought alright a$$hole, you want to be like that i'll let you know just how i appreciate your comments. by this time he was doing them closer and closer each time. so, i picked up a rock about the size of a baseball and nailed the front of his rzr. put a hole in the radiator and the grill. then he called the sheriffs. they came out and took both of our statements and statements from other ppl. he got his machine impounded and was taken into custody for being drunk, disturbing the peace and exhibitionist driving.  
 
the whole point to the story is that more often than not, ppl who run SxS and sport quads have this mentality. most of the time the ppl on sport quads cant go the places i do but the SxS can so i see them more.  
 
AGAIN, have nothing against anyone on this site. i'm not trying to make enemies but only to share my opinion and my experiences with the issue.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #31 - 02/26/12 at 16:52:00
 
I get what you're saying, totally. The person you spoke too need to have the law involved early on. I know you hate to go to that extream and mess up someones weekend, but sometimes it's what's needed.
 
My point is that we ALL need to present a united front against abuse of what we have. The people on this site, as far as I've seen, agree. We don't want to ban groups of riders because of a few idiots.
 
We have a RZR because my wife can't drive an ATV for extended periods because of past injuries. I'm pushing 60 yrs young, and I assure you, we don't race around.  Wink
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #32 - 02/26/12 at 19:45:11
 
Quote from SSpeckerwood on 02/26/12 at 14:59:41:


the whole point to the story is that more often than not, ppl who run SxS and sport quads have this mentality. most of the time the ppl on sport quads cant go the places i do but the SxS can so i see them more.


 
 
"...more often than not..."
 
That is just a stupid statement.
 
I am 70 years old and have been riding since 1976 on motorcycles, quads, and snowmobiles.  More often than not, by a wide margin, the people I find on the trails are the greatest.  Willing to help, willing to share, willing to be great riders and friends.
 
I think that a Can Am Renegade would qualify as a sport quad and my wife rides a 50" Razr so that she can go anywhere I do.  So I fit your classification to a tee.  I would like to see the place you can go and have a SxS follow that I could not go as well.
 
I have found idiots on the trails, but very few!!!  I have also apparently found one on this discussion list.
 
No more needs to be said by me on this offensive and stupid thread.
 
StGeorge
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #33 - 02/26/12 at 20:48:11
 
Quote from StGeorge on 02/26/12 at 19:45:11:
Quote from SSpeckerwood on 02/26/12 at 14:59:41:


the whole point to the story is that more often than not, ppl who run SxS and sport quads have this mentality. most of the time the ppl on sport quads cant go the places i do but the SxS can so i see them more.




"...more often than not..."

That is just a stupid statement.

I am 70 years old and have been riding since 1976 on motorcycles, quads, and snowmobiles.  More often than not, by a wide margin, the people I find on the trails are the greatest.  Willing to help, willing to share, willing to be great riders and friends.

I think that a Can Am Renegade would qualify as a sport quad and my wife rides a 50" Razr so that she can go anywhere I do.  So I fit your classification to a tee.  I would like to see the place you can go and have a SxS follow that I could not go as well.

I have found idiots on the trails, but very few!!!  I have also apparently found one on this discussion list.

No more needs to be said by me on this offensive and stupid thread.

StGeorge

 
 
 
 
 
its unfortunate that at 70yrs old you totally miss the point of what a 24 yr old has tried to get across.  
 
ok, you have a sport quad. my apologies for not naming exactly what machines are classified under the proper category.  
 
once again, not everyone out there is a a$$hole.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #34 - 02/27/12 at 06:59:54
 
You can take this for what it's worth to you ..... probably not much..... but  I bought my first three wheeler in 1973 at the ripe old age of 12  from hauling hay , working in the turkeys and whatever else I could find to do  and apparently that means something to some .
 
Last year I bought another Jeep ( my third ) but this time I decided to get a bit involved in the Jeeping community . I have found that in that community there are a number of different groups . Buggys , expedition rigs , heavily modded Jeeps that are streetable  , low budget rigs  and many times whatever a guy or gal can find  to go off road with even though their finances may be tight .  
 
So why bring that up ? Because I don't see anybody on that side fighting about what they ride and how they ride it . They are fighting to keep trails open - something that many  of you  continue to ignore right up until the trails are closed . Then everyone wants to scream and yell but guess what ? It's too late .  
 
While I'm an ATVer  I accept UTVs and appreciate the experience that they offer to those that operate them appropriately  . For those that do that I thank you , for those that don't I will report you .  Same as an ATVer that rides on singletrack trails .  
 
This whole thing is really quite simple . Riding is a privilege , not a right . Take care of it and get along or it will go away . Help when asked  and because you picked up trash three years ago that doesn't give you a life pass .  
 
One more thing . There are some great  Land Managers that are dealing with some crappy laws . It's easy to blame them , I do it too  at times , but it just makes their job harder .  Write your letters , help on trail projects , join an org . , do what you can to give back .
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #35 - 02/27/12 at 10:01:14
 
Quote from quadforce on 02/27/12 at 06:59:54:
You can take this for what it's worth to you ..... probably not much..... but  I bought my first three wheeler in 1973 at the ripe old age of 12  from hauling hay , working in the turkeys and whatever else I could find to do  and apparently that means something to some .

Last year I bought another Jeep ( my third ) but this time I decided to get a bit involved in the Jeeping community . I have found that in that community there are a number of different groups . Buggys , expedition rigs , heavily modded Jeeps that are streetable  , low budget rigs  and many times whatever a guy or gal can find  to go off road with even though their finances may be tight .  

So why bring that up ? Because I don't see anybody on that side fighting about what they ride and how they ride it . They are fighting to keep trails open - something that many  of you  continue to ignore right up until the trails are closed . Then everyone wants to scream and yell but guess what ? It's too late .

While I'm an ATVer  I accept UTVs and appreciate the experience that they offer to those that operate them appropriately  . For those that do that I thank you , for those that don't I will report you .  Same as an ATVer that rides on singletrack trails .

This whole thing is really quite simple . Riding is a privilege , not a right . Take care of it and get along or it will go away . Help when asked  and because you picked up trash three years ago that doesn't give you a life pass .

One more thing . There are some great  Land Managers that are dealing with some crappy laws . It's easy to blame them , I do it too  at times , but it just makes their job harder .  Write your letters , help on trail projects , join an org . , do what you can to give back .  

 
 
^^^^^^^x2 what you said Quadforce  
The 2 of us had the chance to go down to the Swell area 2 weeks ago to help on a trail signing project. It was a great day we had ATV guys & gal motorcycle guys and several of us in jeeps. We learned alot like there is always something  we as ATV/UTV  people can do to help keep trails open and open new trails. And as a side benefit we get to find new cool places to ride. Smiley
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #36 - 02/27/12 at 11:25:35
 
I love this sport too much to sit back and not chime in at this point (again).  Many of the responses on here have been well thought out and reasonable (whether you agree with the conclusion or not) while other comments have been nothing more than words thrown on the board to see if anything will stick; these comments have me wondering about the future of this sport.  
 
As many have said before: one of the issues is not with the machine, it is with the individual operator.  There is no legitimate argument that can justify categorizing all riders of a specific OHV (SxS, ATV, MC, etc) as being the same.  Such broad, over-generalizations are dangerous to anyone who enjoys using OHVs on public land.  Inconsiderate people can be found everyone.  I am fortunate to report that most of my encounters with other OHV enthusiasts have been positive.  But there is no argument all riders of X machines are inconsiderate.  
 
The second issue (and what I believe is the issue Doug tried to raise in his atvtv blog post which started this thread) is that there should be a healthy balance of designated trails for specific uses, depending on important factors, such as: ecological impact, use (ie, over use), and safety.  Every single OHV rider should get educated on the risks facing our sport and dedicate themselves to being an ambassador of the sport, even if that means acknowledging there are areas where it is appropriate to limit OHV use from a free for all in order to preserve important riding areas from absolute closure.  
 
These two issues are very distinct, but sometimes become blurred when irresponsible OHV riders use their machines in areas that are not proper (for EXAMPLE: ATVs riding single tack designated trails and large SxS riding 50" trails).  These issues, however, are never the same - depending on the machine being driven (in this case, SxS) as some on this board have claimed.      
 
         
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #37 - 03/07/12 at 17:56:53
 
As one who rides the Paiute just about every other day, I have a problem with someone who singles out SXSs as people who drive too fast.  I ride mostly ATVs and as far as SXSs are concerned the great majority putt around with their families in their machines and are very courteous and conscientious of others.  Although Doug's blog does advocate for 50 inch trails, he does it by indicting a whole class of vehicles and their operators.  Doug you know you are wrong here and you should apologize.  Doug you know where to find me if you would like to discuss this further.
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Re: ATV Television -Anti-UTV stand
Reply #38 - 03/13/12 at 15:35:14
 
It's not SxS's that are ruining the Paiute. It's the BLM/Forest service. They are overmaintaining it by eliminating water crossings, bringing in tons of road base and grading it. ATV's and SxS's are very capable machines but the Paiute is like driving on a highway compared to what it used to be. I say let the trail go. Don't spend any time and money fixing it. Let mother nature "fix it". It would only take a few years and we'd have a good trail system again.
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